MC: What sort of reflections do you have on the past 25 years?  Is there anything you miss about the “old days”? 

Martin:  The past 25 years have been a lot of fun. I think the only thing I miss about the ‘old days’ is the commitment to music and the fact that it was a ‘proper’ underground scene. No designer clothes, just gigs in small venues from bands that were happy to play them and not complain about how they weren’t playing huge gigs and selling thousands of records. There was camaraderie then amongst people, and they helped each other. These days it seems that music takes a second place to image and the scene has been both infiltrated and diluted by a dozen other genres, but mostly industrial, metal and EBM.

MC:  On your website, I see that you don’t spin EBM,  Futurepop, Industrial or Metal.  Some people claim that you can’t possibly have a successful Goth event without spinning those genres.  DJ’s like yourself are living proof that this is not necessarily so. What do you think is the root behind this conception?

Martin:  I find that most of the people that say that are the ones that really only discovered the scene fairly late, after the late eighties explosion of bands making it ‘big’, I still have no idea how that happened and I’m fairly confident, and happy, that it won’t happen again. Too many people came into the scene and tried to adapt it to fit themselves rather than the other way round, and that’s just lazy. I also see no reason for a ‘goth’ DJ to have to incorporate things like industrial, metal or EBM into a set, especially when there is so much music being produced by new bands from the goth and post punk scenes. If you look for it then the scene is as strong today as it ever was. There is an argument that goes “if we don’t play these other styles then we won’t get enough people”, I don’t buy that, and you really have to ask yourself which came first, DJ’s playing this music back from the late nineties because they saw it as the ‘future’ or only playing it because people started asking for it. If DJ’s refused and stayed with the scene that inspired them originally then we wouldn’t be in this mess, but too many caved in, and in my mind are responsible for the slow demise of the idea of what became acceptable as ‘goth’. Its not that I have anything against these other genres, its just that, well, they don’t really fit into what goth is to me, being neither subtle, nor dark.

MC:   This is sort of related to the above question:  many, many people in the modern Gothic community seem to have no knowledge of the many new bands that are keeping the original sounds and inspirations of Gothic music alive.  They claim that this music is “dead”, and the “new” Gothic sound is Metal, EBM, etc.   But there are many, many bands that belie that notion.  It seems to me that maybe the traditional Gothic sound has gone back underground; while the Metal/Industrial dominated sound is the new “mainstream” Goth.  What are your thoughts?

Martin:  I think you have a point, its as if there are two separate camps these days, a mainstream one that sees itself as ‘new’ and ‘gothic’ and a more dedicated one, that some call ‘trad’ that is sticking closely to its roots in post punk and the earlier bands. For me you can’t change a scene that drastically and expect it to still be ‘goth’ when it quite clearly isn’t. How are Rammstein anything to do with the scene, or VNV Nation, or any of these so called ‘gothic’ metal bands. I urge people to listen to them and bands like them and ask themselves a simple question, “Where are these bands roots?”, “What are their influences?”, if the answer is not directly linked to the early eighties dark alternative or post punk then they simply don’t belong in a scene that is so firmly based in that era. I don’t care how ‘dark’ the lyrics are, the music is too far removed. Those claiming that the scene is ‘dead’ are not looking in the right places, or possibly. as I said above, bringing too many of their own influences into the equation seem desperate to be called ‘gothic’, Why? whats so embarrassing about being a rivethead or metaller that you need to add the goth tag to justify your tastes? I listen to a lot of psychobilly bands too, but I wouldn’t dream of calling myself one or demanding that what I like belongs in that genre, so why does goth have to suffer from it? It’s an argument that will rage for some time I fear.

MC:  How did you get involved with the Sophie Lancaster Foundation?  How are the album sales coming along?

Martin:   first became involved shortly after Sophies death in August 2007 when I heard about it via the Whitby Goth Weekend message board, and took it upon myself to try to raise money for some kind of memorial based in Whitby and we decided on a memorial bench. I raised almost £3000 over a four week period, most of it at the October Goth weekend and the bench was installed in January 2008. There has not been a day since where there has not been flowers or ribbons attached to it, she became a symbol almost of the dark alternative scenes’ struggle for the simple right to dress how we wanted to. In August last year I was talking to Andi Sex Gang who suggested I compile a CD release to raise more money, and after a few months of hassling bands I got 15 tracks together and put the album together, called ‘Hope’. This was released on World Goth Day (May 22nd) and has so far raised almost £1500. Small plug here, you can buy it from http://www.stayindie.com/hope – 100% of the money paid goes to the Sophie Lancaster Foundation, the charity set up in her memory to try to change people perceptions of different subcultures.

MC: In the wake of the Sophie Lancaster’s death, I thought it was ironic that such a terrible tragedy happened when Goth culture has really gone mainstream.  For example, top fashion designers openly base their clothes on Gothic elements; Gothic fashions and products are available at the mall; Goth themes are wildly popular in films and television; etc.   25 years ago I would not have been as shocked, but today…..  What do you think is happening?

Martin:  That’s what was so strange, at the time when it would appear that the world had accepted us something like happens, and in such a barbaric way. I wish I understood the minds of such people, it as if they see us as taking things far too seriously, that our influences should remain as entertainment and not be allowed to influence our dress or musical taste. I once thought that the average person maybe saw us a threat, and believed our influences made us one. Maybe they just feel that we are inferior because of that, or that that somehow by deliberately placing ourselves outside of the normal mainstream that we see ourselves as better than them. I remember the same attitude when I was a punk back in 77/78, it’s easier for people to hate something they don’t understand.

MC:  How is Thirteen13 radio doing?  I know you are looking forward to Nostalgia this year, is anything new on the agenda?

Martin:  We’re going through some changes with the radio station right now, after a disastrous couple of months where, if anything could go wrong, it did, wrong shows playing, or at the wrong time. We’ve sorted this out now and at the time of writing are preparing to relaunch the station. Thirteen13 will still be a big part of the new look station, for me it’s a great chance to be able to play tracks that might not normally get the chance to, and to a much bigger audience. Since the start of May I’ve been recording the shows weekly, its been a challenge but one I’ve enjoyed and shortly will also be sending the shows to another station to broadcast a week later, all part of my masterplan to get new music to the masses!

MC:  You have participated in pretty much the “Whos Who” of the international Gothic community. What do you consider to be the seminal events in the world?

Martin: Thank you. 25 years is a pretty long while to still be aiming for world domination I suppose..  Over that time I’ve seen bands come and go, and then come again, I’ve seen the scene grow massively to the point where we have something like WGT with 25,000 people attending, and I’ve been lucky to DJ there as well as some pretty prestigious clubs both in the UK and LA. The goth scene has spread worldwide now and is now probably one of the largest and longest running underground scenes there are. I consider myself lucky to have been at the right place at the right time on many occasions, but none more so when it comes down to music. I’ve worked events like Bats Day, anniversary shows for Alien Sex Fiend and The Batcave, clubs like Release the Bats and Dead and Buried, I’ve DJ’s the Whitby Goth Weekend five times, and in doing all this have met some fantastic people, so yeah, I consider myself very fortunate.

MC:   I see that you are a big fan of New Model Army, one of my favorite bands!  What are some of your favorite NMA songs?  They’ve been called everything from punk to metal, what do you think is the most concise description of them?

Martin:  I think it’s fair to say that NMA are probably my all time favorite bands, it’s hard to pick favorite songs as they change over time, but The Charge would always make my top five. When I first started asking bands for songs for the Sophie album a lot just ignored the email, others took ages and asked loads of questions and demanded contracts. Justin Sullivan answered my email within hours, personally and just attached a bunch of songs letting me choose. I chose ‘Dawn’ from the album ‘High’ as it seemed to fit the mood of the album perfectly. They’re a hard band to categorize, which has probably been a blessing as its not pinned them to any particular following, but I consider ‘dark alternative’ to be the closest, if I had to choose. Justin Sullivan is probably the greatest songwriter of the past 30 years, and a lot better in my mind that some of the so called greats, you can keep your Lennon’s and Dylan’s, he writes about real things, and with a passion that shows he means every word, meeting him this year at Whitby and spending time chatting was definitely a special moment for me.

MC:  What are some of the new bands that you are currently listening to?

Martin: At the moment as far as new bands go, Luxury Stranger are high on the list, a great example of a band taking the post punk sound and running with it, I predict far bigger things for them. Also Beryl Beloved seem to be doing great things in that genre too, as do Principe Valiente and (((S))). The New Mission Creeps album ‘Dark Cells’ is really good too. I’ve also been listening to lot more psychobilly than I used to, I love The Creepshow and Kitty in a Casket.

MC: What are some of the projects you are involved in?

Martin:  I help out at the Whitby Goth Weekend twice a year, handling what is termed as ‘band liaison’ which basically means I’m there to make sure they looked after from when they turn up until after they play, organising the backstage area and making sure they’re on stage on time, as well as helping out with any problems that might occur. I have a club night that I run over the course of that weekend called ‘Nostalgia’ which is a ‘proper’ goth night, working with two really good female DJanes, Velouria and Rae Vinloon and usually one special guest. We operate a strictly no EBM/Metal Industrial rule and cover anything from the early days right up to the newer bands, and try to play the less obvious tracks. So we’ll play Rosetta Stone for instance, but not ‘Adrenaline’ or well slip in some Flesh for Lulu perhaps, with the aim of making it a club night like they used to me, with a modern twist.

MC:  Is there anything else you would like to add?  Congratulations on 25 years in the ‘scene’!

Martin:  Thanks, its been a good quarter decade, and I’m not stopping yet, I have a few things in the pipeline for next year that might be very special if they come off. Thanks to Midnight Calling for the opportunity to sound off, and to anyone that made it all the way through reading it. My biggest thanks as always go to my wife, Brigitte, her tolerance of my ‘hobby’ is legendary!

Cheers!

martin oldgoth
http://www.martinoldgoth.co.uk